my prayers go out to them..

Jason
http://www.survivalgrounds.com</a

Ottawa is not Amsterdam

The biggest difference in the above as he mentioned are the distances travelled, how flat Amsterdam is (although I don’t find Ottawa proper particularly hilly), severeness of winter, and the history of bicycle culture which makes travel by bicycle more socially acceptable along with infrastructure designed with bicycles in mind. The “count the bikes” comment was precisely my point. More bikes equals safer riding and more societal benefits.

The question is “can cyclist volume be increased while maintaining safety.” not “Can we recreate Amsterdam here?”. This of course presumes that increased cycling with decreased environmental impact due to replaced car use and increased personal health benefits from cycling are desireable. If you don’t buy that, then the whole argument is moot. And yes, there’s evidence to support both of these.

A straw man argument that you can’t exactly recreate Amsterdam or Denmark due to societal or infrastructure isn’t particularly relevant. What is relevant is that, in the North American context, its possible to increase active transportation. Will everyone get out of their car and on their bike or walk to work/school, no. And while I’d like to see that that as many as possible do, there are people for whom a car is the most reasonable form of transit for their circumstances. Given that the average commute to a workplace in Ottawa is 7.8km, there’s folks who are going to be way above that, have inadequate infrastructure at their workplace, or need their car for work etc. There’s also people who are not physically capable of cycling. But by and large, most people would be capable of commuting 7.8 km. At least I hope so. Whether they’d do it or not requires addressing of the concerns through promotion and better infrastructure. And before anyone even goes there (and kudos to Justin for not bringing it up) – I’m a taxpayer and my taxes pay for Ottawa’s roads too. I don’t own a car, rarely use a car, and as a taxpayer, my needs are as important as anyone elses. If anyone thinks gas taxes pay for municipal road infrastructure, you need to seriously figure out where your money goes…
The amount of municipal tax money that goes to support automobile infrastructure is enormous.

The idea that cyclists are more of a hazard than cars is simply without basis. There are far fewer cyclists and basic physics (and traffic crash statistics) show that the repercussions of a motorists being negligent are far higher, particularly if cyclists (or pedestrians) are involved.

If motorists are incapable of focussing on driving because of a cyclist on the road, god forbid their cell phone rings or someone in a jog bra goes by. If someone isn’t capable of paying attention when they’re driving, then they should be on transit.

And while spandex is a privilege not a right (and the most egregious offenders seem to be non-cyclists anyway), cycling gear is designed to help regulate body temperature and minimize chafing. I wear it when I ride simply because it’s practical. And if someone notices that I’m wearing it, so much the better. It means they saw me and are probably paying attention.

Les, are you for real? yes
You must have your helmet on to tight…but at least you’re wearing one, unlike too many cyclists.

I will admit that most cyclists respect the rules of the road, however, when even one cyclist decides to violate these laws during their ride it jeopardizes road safety far more than a single motorist can. My post was about a motorist who “allegedly” plowed through a group of cyclists who were riding in a lane dedicated for cycling. I don’t think any one of the 5 broke any laws. The simple reason is that a bicyle (spelling: bicycle) is not designed for road safety, and as a result makes motorists nervous. Nervousness is never a good state of mind when operating machinery, big or small. And when you group many together (oh say, about 5 maybe), it’s more than a distraction, it’s a hazard. Great logic… especially when the cyclists were cycling within a lane dedicated for cycling. I guess if a motorist were to ride up on a sidewalk and mow down some pedestrians you would again claim that they made the motorist nervous?

I lived in Rotterdam for 5 years Les, and you are misrepresenting the Dutch approach to road safety. There’s nothing wrong with observing another country’s handling of issues and contrasting that with our nation’s policies, but when it comes to cycling, just because you spent two weeks somewhere on a bike does not give you any perspective on things. For instance, did you happen to notice that the design of the roads, traffic lights, etc. is substantially different than in Canada? Sure I noticed the design of the system etc…. 2 weeks in Holland was enough for me to want to have some of what they have. What is wrong with that?

Count the bikes, and look at the landmass – the Netherlands is an entirely different society, better suited for an abundance of cyclists. You simply cannot compare the two countries policies like apples and oranges, nor can you point and say, “Look they’re doing it like this, we should do it to!” What are you a tween on a bridge with a bunch of jumping friends? Some of what they do is applicable over here. I obviously am not expecting a dedicated bike path between Ottawa & Montreal. But I feel that much of what they have done in the Netherlands can be accomplished here in Canada.

And for that type of ignorance you get a reply like this. Openly, I admit, I love cycling as a activity, but I am ashamed to be considered a cyclist. From the ‘optional’ stopping at stop signs/red lights to the ridiculous attire, cyclists on motorways are more trouble than they worth. Really ? More trouble then they are worth? Cyclists have every right to be on public roadways (read up on it). Don’t confuse breaking laws with not having a right to be somewhere.

I hope you’ll have the conviction to make this reply visible to others, because I can’t wait to hear some more uninformed, close-minded rhetoric. Of course I posted your reply…. Can’t wait to see what others have to say.

I sincerely ask you to stop wearing the tights and ‘cycling’ jerseys, it makes you look like an asshole. I think I look good in Spandex – LOL. A white T-shirt and shorts is good enough for the Olympic team training/practice rides, so why not regular cyclists ? Oh wait, I almost forgot, we’re in Ottawa, holier than thou… Comments & insults like this will get you banned from this site. I let it go as part of my “conviction” to allow debate. Do it again and you will be wasting your rant. I won’t post it. Be polite & courteous (please).

I will admit that most cyclists respect the rules of the road, however, when even one cyclist decides to violate these laws during their ride it jeopardizes road safety far more than a single motorist can. The simple reason is that a bicyle is not designed for road safety, and as a result makes motorists nervous. Nervousness is never a good state of mind when operating machinery, big or small. And when you group many together (oh say, about 5 maybe), it’s more than a distraction, it’s a hazard.

I lived in Rotterdam for 5 years Les, and you are misrepresenting the Dutch approach to road safety. There’s nothing wrong with observing another country’s handling of issues and contrasting that with our nation’s policies, but when it comes to cycling, just because you spent two weeks somewhere on a bike does not give you any perspective on things. For instance, did you happen to notice that the design of the roads, traffic lights, etc. is substantially different than in Canada?

Count the bikes, and look at the landmass – the Netherlands is an entirely different society, better suited for an abundance of cyclists. You simply cannot compare the two countries policies like apples and oranges, nor can you point and say, “Look they’re doing it like this, we should do it to!” What are you a tween on a bridge with a bunch of jumping friends?

And for that type of ignorance you get a reply like this. Openly, I admit, I love cycling as a activity, but I am ashamed to be considered a cyclist. From the ‘optional’ stopping at stop signs/red lights to the ridiculous attire, cyclists on motorways are more trouble than they worth.

I hope you’ll have the conviction to make this reply visible to others, because I can’t wait to hear some more uninformed, close-minded rhetoric.

I sincerely ask you to stop wearing the tights and ‘cycling’ jerseys, it makes you look like an asshole. A white T-shirt and shorts is good enough for the Olympic team training/practice rides, so why not regular cyclists ? Oh wait, I almost forgot, we’re in Ottawa, holier than thou…

I agree — this fellow will get a “slap on the hand.”

I have my driven my road bike since this “incident”.

Very sad.

Here, it seems that that cycling is viewed as more recreational than utilitarian and most cyclists I see are on the bike paths rather than the road. That may have something to do with where I live (Carlingwood), but the best way to make cyclists safe is to have more of them on the road. There’s pretty good evidence that increased cyclists are associated with a decrease in crashes that involve cars.

Unfortunately, its incidents like this that keep cyclists from riding on the road. What burns me even more is that motorists who hit cyclists are often charged under the Hiqhway Traffic Act rather than face criminal charges. That’s not particularly relevant, I guess, I just get a sick feeling in my stomach everytime I look at the picture, knowing the guy who did this will likely get off with little more than a fine. Having lost two friends to inattentive motorists, I’m not particularly forgiving on this count.